Program changes to modules

I know it can change the internal programs but what about programs in a sound module??? Is anyone doing this?? Is it just like a Control Change meaning you have to have the same program number in the 2500 as the module?? Can anyone help me with this?? My ultimate goal here is to be able to load up a track in the mpc and all my modules change to their appropriate programs for that track. This would be done using a program change right?? If not is there any way to do this??

-thanks

Upright, using the MSB/LSB setting on the MPC, you can pull up all your sound module patches directly from the MPC.

Ok thanks J...... time to hit the manual.

Go to the Pgm field (PROGRAM) on a given track. Change this from internal program to external: No. 1, No. 2, No. 3, etc These settings are used to scroll through patches of connected sound modules. For additional settings while your cursor is in this field.....hit the WINDOW key. Here you can turn on BANK SELECT and make MSB/LSB settings. You will have to turn to your sound modules manual for the MSB/LSB default settings for your particular sound module. Every sound module has its own settings. Also, you can turn on submit PROGRAM CHANGES in track if that is what you want to do.

I hope this info is useful.

Very useful.....thank you very much.
I'm bouncing back a forth between manuals , putting everything together.

Thanks again J

No problem. Its a breath of fresh air to actually talk about the MPC 2500 again.

Most sound modules will not use the MSB setting, and will use LSB=0-x for the bank changes. Others however can take a bit of research and experimentation. My Korg Karma for example needs MSB=63 before the LSB will work.

Don't forget to switch the 'Bank Select' to YES and 'Transmit Program changes' to YES also.

Just as a point of interest. Bank MSB and LSB are simple control changes. cc#0 and cc#32 respectively. Always helps to understand these things I find

Rozzer wrote:
Most sound modules will not use the MSB setting

I can't speak for most...but the latest Multi-timbral sound modules from Roland, and Yamaha...as well as older ones like Emu do use MSB settings for quickly getting to patches located in different banks..

For example...Rolands Fantom X has different MSB settings for its Presets, SRX expansion boards, Rhythm sections, and USER preset sections....EMUs Proteus has different MSB settings for its USER, COMPOSER, and other EXPANSION card banks.......Yamaha Motif ES MSB setting in 63 were you can access most sounds using LSB settings of 0-5 and 32.

MSB/LSB settings are nothing new. However, the current MPCs offer the easiest way to assign these settings to each track unlike MPCs before them.

I know Access products allows for midi dumping. It also relies on your module if you can send that data to the mpc. you can probably save it in a project file.

jahrome wrote:

Rozzer wrote:
Most sound modules will not use the MSB setting

I can't speak for most...but the latest Multi-timbral sound modules from Roland, and Yamaha...as well as older ones like Emu do use MSB settings for quickly getting to patches located in different banks..

Quite why any of them use MSB+LSB at the same time is beyond me. I've yet to come across a sound module that had more than 128 banks of 128 programs, which is what you can address with LSB alone.

Rozzer wrote:
Quite why any of them use MSB+LSB at the same time is beyond me. I've yet to come across a sound module that had more than 128 banks of 128 programs, which is what you can address with LSB alone.

Rozzer wrote:
Others however can take a bit of research and experimentation. My Korg Karma for example needs MSB=63 before the LSB will work.

Well....MSB takes you to a specific section/location within the sound module (User, Preset, GM, Sample, Memory Card, etc)...LSB takes you to a particular bank of sounds within these locations (the Fantom XR has approximately 20 such locations)...program allows you to select a patch(up to 128).

I don't know the specific reasoning behind MSB/LSB...I just know the way it works with the Roland XR and XV 5080, Yamaha Motif ES, and Emu Porteus 2000. I had a best guess, but after reading up on these functions..I started to get more confused than ever. So, I no longer care (for now) why it works the way it does, but will just accept the fact that it works because that's how these companies intend for it to work....well, thinking about it further...it seems each of these companies have MSB/LSB settings specific to their modules. If that is the case, I can see the potential need to use both MSB/LSB in a complex MIDI set-up. Because while no hardware synth that I am aware of has 128 banks of 128 patches, you can create a complex MIDI set-up with multiple modules that can potentially exceed this (nothing I will ever do though).

Ok I am still trying to work around with this MSB/LSB stuff.

One of my modules changes to it's pattern without any issuse, great.

The other module is isn't. I can change the pattern from the mpc by changing the program number, but when I press play on the mpc it's playing the module in the pre-set patterns instead of the user patterns which is where I want it to play. I am assuming that this has something to do with the MSB/LSB settings. I will type here exactly what the manual says about MSB/LSB and hopefully you guys can help me make since of it all.


Bank Select/Program Change messages
These messages will switch kits.
Transmit the bank number and then the
program number. The bank number alone will
not switch the kit. If you don’t need to change
the bank number, you can simply transmit the
program number alone.
* For details on the messages that can be received and
transmitted by a connected external device, refer to the
manual for that device.
Pitch Bend/Bend Range
Pitch bend messages are messages that change
the pitch of the bass. You can use RPN messages
to specify the range within which the pitch is
permitted to change (bend range).
For example, if you want to set the bend range to
12, transmit the following messages.
RPN MSB (CC#101) 00
RPN LSB (CC#100) 00
DATA ENTRY MSB (CC#6) 12 (the desired value)






Believe me I am trying my best to make sense of this but all this stuff is pretty much like spanish to me if anyone can help I would be most thankful

Do you know the MSB/LSB settings for your sound module? If so, you shouldn't have any problems if you make those settings on your MPC..and turn on both bank select and submit program changes on track.

Now if you turn OFF bank select but keep submit program changes in track ON, you can still use the PGM field to select patches from your MPC. Using this method, your sound module will stay in its current bank.

Its correct that if you have bank select turned ON and MSB/LSB are in correct, your sound module will jump to a bank that you don't want.

Ok lets see if I can find the MSB/LSB settings.....thanks for you patience J , sooner or later I'll get this right.

If you don't need to use those settings, just keep the bank select turned OFF. However, turn ON submit program change in track. This way, you can set the bank directly from the sound module and use PRG changes to select the patch from your MPC.

A quick way to setup a multi-tmbral sound module with your MPC is to put it in performance/multi mode. In performance mode, you can assign an instrument to each of your sound modules 16 MIDI channels. Than with your MPCs bank selection turn OFF and Program changes turned ON, you can easily create MPCs tracks using the 16 instruments assigned to your sound modules performance/multi section.