2007, MPC2000XL, Sampling

I've got a Digi 002, ProTools LE, Reason 3, and an MPC2000XL, etc. etc.
On top of that, a plethora of plug-ins, sound banks, and vinyl.

Every ounce of science in me tells me to avoid using the MPC2000XL for sampling - "the sound will not compete in 2007". But the "hip-hop in me" tells me to make sweet, sweet love to the MPC2000XL all night and all day.

What do I do?

sell all your gear and call it a day....



on the real...do what you see fit....If sampling in the xl aint for you, don't do it...

Lame u know...dont ask us what to do man...if it feels off for u dont do it.

I dunno dude. If you have ever read scratch magazine.... there are a grip of kats (major dudes) who still sample in their drum machines. I guess it all depends what your looking to do. If you are going for the authentic grimey hiphop sound, I wouldnt worry about the 2000xl's limitations. Its worked for years, and I firmly believe that it will still work years down the road. Now if your going for superior sonic 24bit whatever whatever... then yeah, sample into something that will get you higher quality I guess. But as far as I'm concerned... all them kats (kanye, just blaze, dr. dre, etc) still use they drum machines to sample... sooo that should tell you something.

www.hcr.fm
www.3hmp3.com

(sorry, lame plug there).

If you can't compete it is not about your gear. Computer's and reason ect only emulate what older hardware and tape does anyway.

anything sounds good if you operate it with skill and creativity

nothing good can come from having sex with a machine

that my friend is where you have made your mistake.

Where do people get these ideas? Normal people don't sit around and worry about what sort of technology was utilized to make a good song. The only important thing is that the song speaks to the soul of the listener. Do the best with what you got. There is no rule saying you have to do this or use that; none of that sh*t matters.

The only time to worry about that ish is when your gear or process adds undesired sound or noise. A good producer should know their gear well enough to avoid that kind of mess....

i listen to some stuff from the early 80's when they had no Midi, no advanced form of sampling or sequencing and new technology was still rather primitive.....and that stuff still sounds fresher than most of the stuff out today.

Its all in your head for real

I knew this was going to push some buttons. Sorry.

Lame u know...dont ask us what to do man...if it feels off for u dont do it.

That's exactly my problem. It doesn't "feel" off, it sounds off. The feel is right on the money. I'm wondering if maybe there's a better way to use the MPC2000XL ("technically") than I'm capable of seeing. I WANT TO USE THE MPC2000XL...my engineer doesn't.

I dunno dude. If you have ever read scratch magazine.... there are a grip of kats (major dudes) who still sample in their drum machines. I guess it all depends what your looking to do.

I do read Scratch. Sadly, I'm hard-pressed to find any solid in-studio references to the MPC2000XL aside from just a pitcure or it's name in some equipment list. I know people still use it...but what about the big-wigs?

If you are going for the authentic grimey hiphop sound, I wouldnt worry about the 2000xl's limitations. Its worked for years, and I firmly believe that it will still work years down the road.

That's the thing. The MPC2000XL definitely has a unique, "grimey" sound. Some would even say this sound is essential to hip-hop! But in my experience, I have not been able to make what I would consider to be a 'commercial track with a hot sound' entirely sampled with the MPC2000XL. They always sound great straight from the machine, but once I get to mixdown, I ALWAYS hit a dead end with the sound.

In short, the beats I make on the MPC2000XL definitely pass the "genre test"...but they never pass the "environment test". The beats I make otherwise usually pass the "environment test", but they rarely have the same feel/motion/energy of the MPC2000 beats. It could just be me though...

Now if your going for superior sonic 24bit whatever whatever... then yeah, sample into something that will get you higher quality I guess. But as far as I'm concerned... all them kats (kanye, just blaze, dr. dre, etc) still use they drum machines to sample... sooo that should tell you something.

This is what I'm talking about. Do Kanye, Just Blaze, Dre, etc. still use the MPC2000XL? I know they use drum machines, but the 2000XL? Common sense would tell me that these folks have moved on to the MPC4000 or better.

i listen to some stuff from the early 80's when they had no Midi, no advanced form of sampling or sequencing and new technology was still rather primitive.....and that stuff still sounds fresher than most of the stuff out today. Its all in your head for real

No doubt. But this is 2007. You gotta admit that things were a lot less commercialized in the 80's.

You really believe a track sounds better when the stuff is sampled in 48 or 96 kHz instead of 44?

You really believe a track sounds better when the stuff is sampled in 48 or 96 kHz instead of 44?

Well, if you're bringing a 16bit/44kHz sample into a 24bit/96kHz session...I would imagine that it would sound better if the sample were 24bit/96kHz in the first place. Please let me know if this is incorrect, because I make a lot of decisions based on sample/bit-rate.

In the case of the MPC2000:
Vinyl(Usually)->In(ADC)->16bit/44kHz->Out(DAC)->16bit/44kHz->In(Digi002,ADC)->24bit/96kHz->Out(CD,Downsample)->16bit/44kHz...right?
Don't forget all the coloring that occurs during the ADC/DAC.

Some people would say that if it's all ending up at 16bit/44kHz (CD audio) then it doesn't matter...I can't say I agree.

swordphish wrote:In the case of the MPC2000:
Vinyl(Usually)->In(ADC)->16bit/44kHz->Out(DAC)->16bit/44kHz->In(Digi002,ADC)->24bit/96kHz->Out(CD,Downsample)->16bit/44kHz...right?

You're wrong there. DAC (meaning Digital-Analog Conversion) produces an analog signal - just like the one that comes from your turntable. How it differs from the original now only depends on how you treat it in the machine (EQ, effects etc...) and a little bit on the AD/DA chips of the machine.

If you wanna import samples into a software directly, ok, it might be easier to have a file in the right format and not having to convert it. But apart from that, I think 2000XL quality is very fine in an age of MP3-downloads and mobile ringtones...

swordphish wrote:
That's the thing. The MPC2000XL definitely has a unique, "grimey" sound. .

no, it doesn't...I wish people would stop saying this...when this piece first dropped, that was one of the downfalls of it, it was "too clean" most people said...Now all of a sudden, almost 10 years later, it suddenly has this grimey sound??

nah, not buying it...

You're wrong there. DAC (meaning Digital-Analog Conversion) produces an analog signal - just like the one that comes from your turntable. How it differs from the original now only depends on how you treat it in the machine (EQ, effects etc...) and a little bit on the AD/DA chips of the machine.

I'm not sure where my error is...
I think I meant for: Out(DAC)->16bit/44kHz- >In(Digi002,ADC)
to be: Out(DAC)->In(Digi002,ADC)
Anyway, ADC/DAC isn't why I'm posting this question (I think).

no, it doesn't...I wish people would stop saying this...when this piece first dropped, that was one of the downfalls of it, it was "too clean" most people said...Now all of a sudden, almost 10 years later, it suddenly has this grimey sound?? nah, not buying it...

(Read: "Grimey sound" originally posted by holycultureradio )
I disagree. The MPC2000 definitely has some colorizations COMING OUT. Going in...I'm not so sure about. Whether these colorizations add anything to the grimey sound - I don't know. Anyway, this is kind of where I hit a crossroads. Could this 'grimey sound' be some sort of flaw in the techniques of the producers? Could this 'grimey sound' be why I have trouble getting my tracks mixed?

I've read about things like ADC/DAC, word-clocks, Jitter and other anamolies, dithering, etc. but I'm not sure what to make of it and how it applies directly to the MPC2000. Should I be tracking beats digitally off the MPC2000 somehow?

If you wanna import samples into a software directly, ok, it might be easier to have a file in the right format and not having to convert it. But apart from that, I think 2000XL quality is very fine in an age of MP3-downloads and mobile ringtones...

Good advice. But what about the commercial hip-hop market of 2007. Can the same exact beat made on an MPC2000XL compete against the same beat made on a newer drum-machine/equipment?