potential tip: tracking idea

Thanks lamp, that makes sense.


So I'm wondering, does "resampling" on the 1k change the bit rate of the sample? Does it affect the sonic quality of the sound (provided you dont apply effects and then sample again)

So if I sampled origionally in 16 bit, then "resample" on the 1k, does it change the bit rate?

Lithion wrote:Thanks lamp, that makes sense.


So I'm wondering, does "resampling" on the 1k change the bit rate of the sample? Does it affect the sonic quality of the sound (provided you dont apply effects and then sample again)

So if I sampled origionally in 16 bit, then "resample" on the 1k, does it change the bit rate?

You'd have to refer to the manual and see what exactly it's doing when it resamples.

I think the 1k manual is speaking on resampling as internally recording the playback, not changing the sampling rate at all. 44khz / 16 bit, the 44100khz is the sampling rate you might be talking about, the bit rate is a different story I would think, don't confuse the 2.

Is the 1k changing the sampling rate when resampling. I'm gonna guess no. I think the 1k is actually internally boucing down the playback into a sample, not sure if it bounces down before the converters or after. That would be something an experienced 1k user could answer, not me though.

Lampdog wrote:44khz / 16 bit, the 44100khz is the sampling rate you might be talking about, the bit rate is a different story I would think, don't confuse the 2.

if you look at a waveform as a graph with x and y axis, bit depth ends up being the y axis while sample rate is the x axis. the higher the bit depth, the more points along the y axis can be used. the higher the sample rate, the more points along the x axis can be used. this is why sampling at higher sample rate and bit depth sounds truer, because the waveform is closer to looking like the true analog waveform of the sound that was sampled.

i edited this to change bit rate to bit depth as per Mr modnaR. i'm so used to saying bitrate but he's right, it should be bit depth. bitrate includes both bit depth and sample rate.

also: it's bit depth not bit rate.

hey - my $0.05 worth -

what about syncing up to your DAW (logic, cubase etc...) using MTC and sending your tracks or mix via the SPDIF.
if you need em back in the MPC later just pop them back on the CF card - as long as you record 16bit 44.1khz.

this is of course if you want them in the DAW in the first place.

cheers

f

i've used this method and recorded a beat track by track into my daw, then recorded the same beat as a stereo track and played them side by side in the daw. it's very disturbing how much phasing you hear, they are way out of time with each other.using midi sync, mtc or midi clock, to do a track by track bounce into your daw will, in my experience, totally screw up the "mpc" feel of a beat. as of now , the only way to preserve the "mpc groove" is to track the individual outputs in one simultaneous take, or you lose the feel.
This is why I feel it's such an important feature to develope, if you could internally bounce each track digitally in the mpc and the result would be SAMPLE ACCURATE, so you could just transfer them to your daw via usb and have the digital sound quality and not have to worry about losing the mpc feel.
I personally feel this is probably the most important and vital feature for the mpc, and i hope enough other people feel this way to petition this feature- anyone else?

i've found that the more i get used to working in my daw post tracking from the, the less mpc feel i lose in my daw. especially when you record say your six main drum pads in one take, so they're all locked in the same "group."

again, i'll tout reaper: say you track these 6 pads out individually in reaper. you can "Group" them by hilighting them and hitting G. now, they're all locked together, yet individually editable.

i used to have a problem with losing my original groove while tracking in acid. Edge City at times strayed from what i originally intended when working in my mpc - just in very tiny ways, milliseconds, but as you know mstrpig that's enough to screw you up!

interesting idea. an automated track by track bouncedown, a "macro," which saves each track as an internally resampled wav onto a specified folder in the HD.

i doubt we'll see the day, but it sure is a great idea!

Yes, a macro is all we need this has been brought up numerous times and would be great.
But as I said before, to do it manually, couldn't you just solo each track and record it onto an audiotrack - so that is it trimmed to the loop, then transfer these via USB. A bit time consuming though.

Yeah i've had alot of the same problems tracking into cubase and reaper, even when using MTC. The other way is ofcourse to line the tracks up using a click at the beginning. I did this in my last song, and the tracks were in time together, but wandered out of time with the reaper grid, getting worse towards the end.
I also have six inputs and try and do the six drumtracks at one, but when you're dealing with stereo hats and snares you become very limited.

Antonym wrote:i've found that the more i get used to working in my daw post tracking from the, the less mpc feel i lose in my daw. especially when you record say your six main drum pads in one take, so they're all locked in the same "group."

again, i'll tout reaper: say you track these 6 pads out individually in reaper. you can "Group" them by hilighting them and hitting G. now, they're all locked together, yet individually editable.

I've used Acid and Vegas (mostly vegas) for years now, I could have sworn that there is a group function in both programs, I've used before.

I am thinking that's where Reaper got that from.

Yep... in Vegas 'G' is for group selected events, 'U' ungroup selected event, CTRL-G clears the whole group.

Very useful feature.

mstrpig wrote:i've used this method and recorded a beat track by track into my daw, then recorded the same beat as a stereo track and played them side by side in the daw. it's very disturbing how much phasing you hear, they are way out of time with each other.using midi sync, mtc or midi clock, to do a track by track bounce into your daw will, in my experience, totally screw up the "mpc" feel of a beat. as of now , the only way to preserve the "mpc groove" is to track the individual outputs in one simultaneous take, or you lose the feel......

yeah that makes pure sense....BUT i wouldnt use midi/mtc, midi isnt tight enough clockwise, but a digital clock in the audio signal is much better, slave the daw's digital audio clock/sync to 'slave' and use the mpc as master, then....

record just pure digital audio takes of the mpc tracks one by one......THEN, assuming you've put a 1bar intro click on the bagining of each track at zero [00.00.00] time, u can then just line up the takes in the daw, at sample accurate level....using the clicks...then set the daw to the tempo u were running on the mpc.

what happens is that when you sample the main out it bypasses the secret roger linn 'knock' that is still buried in even the newest mpc's...but don't tell roger!

why ANYONE would use ANY of the fx on mpc's is beyond me - they are ALL total garbation and if you are serious about getting a solid sonic depth then NEVER EVER USE THEM

see, the thing is,- first, your right about not bothering with the midi or mtc to sync up with, the best way i've found so far (from a post from another forum member and i'm so sorry i can't find his post to quote/ give him credit), is to sync your daw up to your soundcard's clock and do them track by track, starting each track with a bar of click ( i use a finely trimmed square wave so i can line it up sample accurate). but the thing is, in my tests, the mpc's timing drifts very subtly, by 2-4 milliseconds always, wich is a GOOD thing, it's what's responsible for it's groove,but as a result, that bar of clicks that preceeds each track that your supposed to be using to line the tracks up with in your daw is'nt stable enough. wich is why now i've found you really have to track everything in one pass.
it was mentioned in a previous post that the internal rendering is not sample accurate, so stacking up multiple internally rendered tracks will not work as it stands now because they will be slightly different lengths.but if you could internally bounce each track and it WERE sample acurate, the LENGTH would be correct for each track, making it copy and pasteable within your daw, even if the timing within each track drifted that little bit, (the little bit that's responsible for the mpc groove), and when you lined up the imported tracks in your daw-viola!.
i hope i explained that right- it's hard to explain for this dyslexic, floppy eared pig-but i think it's doable in the jj os- it comes down to making the internal rendering sample acurate.