if you could set 6 params to a midi controller, what ones?

ya'll have heard me babble about midisense before. but today, with the jj os, it means more to the mpc1000 than ever before. Midisense (or any controllerr with sliders/knobs etc, midisense is just ultracool/portable) will allow you to externalize far more control over your sounds than we can w/ just 2 qlinks.

here's the deal: there are TONS of sweet params that i love to have instant access to, but sometimes i'm a little too lazy to enter step edit and adjust tons of attack params, etc. so that's why i'm building a mpc specific midisense, a MODULAR addition to the mpc1000 with 6 sensors in it (3 faders, 2 rotary controls, 1 modmodular infrared)

this way i will have instant hands on control to additional param control. less editing, more live tweaking.

so what ones would you pick? i have tentatively picked the ones that i feel will let me be the most controlling and sporadic with my samples. some are obvious choices, others are less obvious. i'll start with the obvious:

slider 1: TRACK qreal TUNE. can't never go wrong with tune. this slider, i'll take from an old junked turntable. it's a huge slider, which is great, and what's even better is that there's a detent in the middle (which is safely at 0). this will make it easy to nudge the entire track up/down and then bring it square back to zero.

slider 2: TRACK qreal FILTER CUTOFF. i only ever really use a lowpass filter, so i'll set this sucker to lowpass and call it a day. i'll use this slider to add very subtle filter bits to my songs, just enough to tell that the sound is changing but not enough to be like "kid's using that filter a lot." i've found that this is what the mpc1000's filters are best for: subtly changing up a sound to keep it from getting stale.

knob 1: TRACK qreal RESONANCE. Resonance is the lesser known qreal control. i rarely set resonance to qlink, usually i just set it to a level and leave it there. no longer will that be the case. i'll set res to knob 1 and use it to complement the above filter, as i described just a second ago. NOTE: knob 1 and slider 2 will be "grouped" right next to each other since they're related.

slider 3: TRACK qlink note on SAMPLE START. i have been sleeping on SAMPLE START. sample start is infinitely dope for REALLY controlling the freshness of your samples. you can sculpt so much of your sound just by knocking off the first split second of it. you can take the pop out of a snare and leave the tail. you can cut the attack out of a bass note and get left with a solid tone. for sample mangling, there's really not much better...except when SAMPLE START is paired with...

knob 2: TRACK qlink note on ATTACK. similar to sample start but with the obvious different of the fade in. having a dedicated knob to control attack will be glorious, as this is easily one of the most powerful functions in any sampler. to be able to add just a TINY bit of attack to a single drum hit makes it sound like a completely different note. couple this with sample start control and you can really get the most out of your samples, INST or DRUM.

that's 5. midisense has 6 inputs. i will be using the last with my infrared sensor for "glissando" control, which is essentially like taking your finger and running it up and down the piano keys, hitting every note in succession. except in this case, i'll be waving my hand up and down and playing every note in a pgm. this is very very cool for a variety of reasons: create an INST pgm, drop a single sample on there w/ a range from 0-127, turn up the portamento, and you have a theremin. you can even send this through midi out to control external gear just by waving your hand.

2nd, there's a mpc version of scratching you can do with this. here's how: take a short sample, maybe someone saying a very short phrase. enter CHOP. chop it to 64 pieces. have these go to a new program. now, wave your hand! as you bring your hand down, it starts running through these 64 samples. you can control the granular playback speed by moving slower or faster. if you REALLY want to go nuts, set each sample to LOOP ON...ho lee sht, very cool stuff.

so that's my tirade. what params would YOU control?

nym. i was looking at this the other day off of your website. there are ridiculous possibilities with this thing. once i pick up my max/msp certification this summer, i'm definitely picking one of these things up. but i would control these parameters.

slider 1: i would stick with your tune decision. that is a solid parameter that is very useful for live performance.

slider 2: again. i would stick with your choice of filter cutoff. i use filters the same way. most of the time. and just use a low pass. cause the filters on the mpc are terrible in the scheme of things.

knob 1: here i would differ from you. i would apply general tempo to this. i would love this type of control. to slowly be able to sweep from faster tempo to slower.

slider 3: i would apply this to speed of rate of lfo. i use lfos so so much within my instrument programs and in other areas. this would be a very cool effect that you could use on something that was sequenced using an instrument program with an lfo applied.

knob 2: i would apply this to for instance the amount of reverb applied to a sound or track. this could be used on all of the types of effects that when you go into the mixer there is that little vertical bar that lets you choose how much of that effect is being applied to the sound or track. i am tentative about this one, but this is what i thought of off the top of my head (i am not infront of my mpc right now).

for the inferred sensor, i would most likely stick with what you have right now. there is one of these i think on the roland fanton x6. I have messed with it at guitar center a couple of times, and its pretty damn cool. But then of course it would be great to have this applied as a glissando function but have a hold button so you could be waving your hand and having it go up and then hit the hold button, and it sticks at that pitch. or if this inferred sensor is applied to pitch, and you already have a sequence line with an instrument program, you could use the inferred sensor to for instance, raise the entire track an octave or a certain amount of semi tones (half steps), and you could still use this hold button for this.

i really like the general tempo idea, that'd definitely be useful
rate of LFO is great, too, for sure. hell, if i could i'd have a whole controller dedicated to JUST the lfos, and another one JUST for adsr

the nice thing about midisense is that you can make a couple of them and just chain em together

the tempo one i wish there was some way to automate in jj. one question though. will you sell these. or are you just asking for other people's opinions.

you can set qlink to tempo in jj os 1 or 2 already
go to tempo, hit window

i probably will not be selling these
instead i'll open source all steps taken in building them
but if someone really really wants me to build one personally for em and make it work out of the box i will probably do that

ahhh you are awesome for telling me this. i never knew. YES. finally i can do this.

i'll keep that in mind, that one person may be me.

yeah i'm psyched about this whole mpc controller because it'll free up the qlinks for more FUNCTIONAL capability as opposed to more traditional qlink usage

ie, tempo
ie, in midi grid edit, the note duration and velocity

right now i get conflicted because i use the qlinks w/ filter, sample start, etc etc etc, and when i try to do the above i end up screwing with my qlink params without intending to.

this way, the qlink params will be right at my fingertips via CC

midisense is some seriously cool shit, i highly recommend that everyone gets involved. it's very cheap, too, and you can get sliders/knobs from old, broken gear.

yeah i know what you mean about the q-links. I barely use them anymore cause they are so faulty, and to get what you want exactly it takes a lot of messing around. I can just do what i want to do with q-real grid edit.

On the topic of getting interested, trust me, i am, when i get my max/msp certification this summer (i am assuming you know what max/msp is, if not, look it up on wikipedia or some videos of it on youtube, but its ridiculously powerful) i am definitely going to pick one of these up, if not for my mpc but just for messing around with. On the topic of buying a midisense, where can you order one, i browsed the website that you have linked of your own, for quite some time and i couldn't find anything about ordering it. I know you sort of already answered this, but if i obviously payed for the board and all of the assembly of one and payed you for all of the sliders, knobs, and obviously an extra for you making it for me, would you do exactly that, make one for me. Cause before i get my max/msp certification, which also comes with sensor building, this summer, i have no knowledge of soldering or sensor building or anything of that type.

ada's store is here:
http://www.adafruit.com/index.php?main_ ... ex&cPath=9

maxmsp is DOPE. the only downside is that a computer must be present. i'm most interested in having a completely portable unit (for my mpc, anyway - my home midisense units can be fully maxmsped!!)

i'd happily make one for you, but it probably won't be til i've finished at least 2 of my own just to perfect my technique. we'll have to discuss the fine details of what type of controls you'd like, as they're all totally interchangeable...there are also buttons that you can put in, just regular tact switches like play, stop etc

BUT i am gonna say that after a couple days of soldering practice, you'd be ready to put this together yourself. i have no magic touch, just some functional ideas and a TON of interest in building midi controllers that aren't just some run of the mill box, but specifically TAILORED to a very unique use. the modular use is also great - it will truly be a part of the jjos2 sampler, a "3rd operations board."

of course none of this will really work til jj's midi cc in gets implemented, and how it gets implemented.

this stuff gets more exciting to me every day man

thanks for the link man.

i'm definitely going to look into getting one of these. and i know some of my brothers friends who are in college for this shit. like they make effects pedals and shit. who know a lot about soldering and home made midi controllers. i bet i can get them to put one together for me.

the thing that is so intriguing about this thing to me. is that with what i have read from the website is you can reconfigure it anyway you want to suit your specific needs for a specific project. this is the thing that i love so much about the intergration of the computer into my workflow. i just need that tactile thing that i can put my hands on, i.e. the mpc or in this instance the sliders. this is my argument against a fully computer based workstation. yes there are midi controllers, but some people don't get one of those, i just don't understand how people do it. but then again. i am originally a drummer, so that may explain why i need that thing i can put my hands on.

man, i'll definitely email or pm you or something if i ever actually get around to either getting one of these made or just help with it or whatever. keep up the work, with development and sh**, the word of jj needs to be preached. hah that sounds really corny, but people really need to get to using OS2. And i don't know if you ever check but i did a full overhaul of the JJ OS section of the wikipedia article for the MPC a couple days ago. If you have information that you want to add, can you either add it or just give it to me if you don't know modified html. The only reason i ask, is cause when i was first researching getting a mpc, wikipedia was a place i looked for information and there wasn't really any, so i just want to help future people who are looking into getting one by making that resource, a reliable one by having sources cited and such, and having it be a plentiful source of information.

I am still not sure what any of this means. Good luck.

prime it's nothing really revolutionary, really. it's just immediate tactile access to parameters that otherwise would take a couple seconds to "set up." this would speed up workflow immensely and lead to better/smarter usage of these functions because they'd be immediately at the fingertips. just think of it as an "add on" to the mpc, an additional box in the same spirit.

raider and others who have even taken a cursory interest in Midisense:

this is NOT a difficult project. it takes a little time and you may accidentally burn yourself with the soldering iron. it happens, no big deal.

however, it does have its tricky parts. none of them are that serious. here are the difficult bits with midisense:

1- gathering the sensors. solution: search the internet or just ask me, i have a general idea of what works and what doesn't. most sensors that you'd likely be buying are anywhere from .99 usd to $36

2- if this is a portable unit, building a box for midisense. i'm gonna build mine into a hollowed out book. mine's gonna be a portable unit so it's gotta be durable. however, if yours is not portable, you can literally MOUNT it in a safe place, like the underside of your desk.

3- finding wires to connect the sensors with. solution: just find a spare ethernet cord and cut it open. use those wires. or wires from a phone cord. the cool thing is that these can be as long as you want.

this is why i'm so looking forward to the midi CC stuff. the more things in the MPC controllable via midi the better as far as i'm concerned. once JJ implements this in OS 2 i'm thinking about picking up one of these:
http://www.zzounds.com/item--NOVSLZERO

what's critical for me is those lcd displays. i need to see an immediate readdout of what i'm about to change instead of having to memorize what all of those sliders & knobs do. this way you can also have different settings stored in the controller for different programs, depending on what you want to control at the time. one look at the display and you'll see what everything is controlling.

Nym, if you haven't already you might want to check out the Mawzer modular midi interface. it's way pricey but a very cool concept that lets you build your own controller layout. just check out the pics and you'll get what it is immediately:

http://images.google.com/images?q=mawzer

as far as Max/MSP goes, i've been using it for a number of years now. the nice thing about Max is that if you can verbally describe something, you can pretty much build it in Max. i haven't been using Max that much recently since i've been working almost exclusively with my MPC but once the midi CC gets implemented you'll be able to do some absolutely crazy stuff with Max & the MPC.

the_raider wrote:ahhh you are awesome for telling me this. i never knew. YES. finally i can do this.

i'll keep that in mind, that one person may be me.

the window button is your best friend!

u guys have between you covered all id need
its a great idea and il defiantly read more into it, and nym open sourcing the information u get from doing this is very generous and i look forward to the result

so is that thing able to in between the MPC and another controller?

Keyboard >> Midisense >> MPC

the infarded "theremin" is pretty cool, but ideally you would have another sensor that affected the volume of the program as well. one hand for pitch, one hand for volume