I have finally cracked it!

At last after buying the 4k a fair while ago I have finally sat down over the past 4weeks and learnt to use this.
Got my autoload sorted (now i understand the gain offsets everything is working)
My autoload includes programs and sequences and step sequenced cc stuff and multis.

Got the step seq working hard.

Finally found the best way to use keygroup programs. Its like having the new akai 5k simultaneous mode but x100.

A few more days and I should have some absolutely brilliant acoustic kit patches with real room ambience on sliders etc.

Its been a long haul, and because of the awful documentation its been really confusing and at times very frustrating.

However I have mpc4k/autoload/macbook/bias peak/ all talking like good friends.
At last I can now focus on the music.

Its been a real love/hate journey.
But fundamentally the 4k is hot, I love the fact its a serious sampler.
I grew up on a kurzweil, I want power!

Thanks to everyone for their help.
I almost sold the 4k at the half way point, glad I didn't now.
It has taken me this long though to get everything working as I feel it should.

I would recommend any new user does the following, spend a couple of days programming the deepest drum patches you can in drum mode, then convert them to keygroup programs and take them even further. You can in a keygroup do such wonderful things like...
All on one PAD Take a snare with 4 velocity level switching, then add just the ring from the snare on a slider and a distorted version on another slider, a seperate big snare on another keygroup assigned to fx out with loads of reverb on another slider! All on the same pad.
yeap
keygroups are fully deep.
You can create drum programs for life there!
Just don't forget to key the program level -20db to avoid gain/velocity problems later!

God damn it, it has been hard,
if any one asks me the 4k is an absolute bastard, but one thats worth it in the end.

I can at last use this damn thing fluently.

now I need to make it quieter that fan is beginning to get on my tits!

The only thing I really miss from my 2k is the 16 level attack and decay, and I do really really miss that.
looking forward to learning the sysex stuff from mcsmooth.
My Kurzweil pc3x keyboard arrives in 2weeks and I have cleared enough time and have enough cash now to work on my own music from next month.
AT LAST!
AT FREAKING LAST!
i can use this machine!
g

foge1 wrote:At last after buying the 4k a fair while ago I have finally sat down over the past 4weeks and learnt to use this.
Got my autoload sorted (now i understand the gain offsets everything is working)
My autoload includes programs and sequences and step sequenced cc stuff and multis.

Got the step seq working hard.

Finally found the best way to use keygroup programs. Its like having the new akai 5k simultaneous mode but x100.

A few more days and I should have some absolutely brilliant acoustic kit patches with real room ambience on sliders etc.

Its been a long haul, and because of the awful documentation its been really confusing and at times very frustrating.

However I have mpc4k/autoload/macbook/bias peak/ all talking like good friends.
At last I can now focus on the music.

Its been a real love/hate journey.
But fundamentally the 4k is hot, I love the fact its a serious sampler.
I grew up on a kurzweil, I want power!

Thanks to everyone for their help.
I almost sold the 4k at the half way point, glad I didn't now.
It has taken me this long though to get everything working as I feel it should.

I would recommend any new user does the following, spend a couple of days programming the deepest drum patches you can in drum mode, then convert them to keygroup programs and take them even further. You can in a keygroup do such wonderful things like...
All on one PAD Take a snare with 4 velocity level switching, then add just the ring from the snare on a slider and a distorted version on another slider, a seperate big snare on another keygroup assigned to fx out with loads of reverb on another slider! All on the same pad.
yeap
keygroups are fully deep.
You can create drum programs for life there!
Just don't forget to key the program level -20db to avoid gain/velocity problems later!

God damn it, it has been hard,
if any one asks me the 4k is an absolute bastard, but one thats worth it in the end.

I can at last use this damn thing fluently.

now I need to make it quieter that fan is beginning to get on my tits!

The only thing I really miss from my 2k is the 16 level attack and decay, and I do really really miss that.
looking forward to learning the sysex stuff from mcsmooth.
My Kurzweil pc3x keyboard arrives in 2weeks and I have cleared enough time and have enough cash now to work on my own music from next month.
AT LAST!
AT FREAKING LAST!
i can use this machine!
g

Great as I and others like dabmeister, faderpro, rookie, lord toranaga, Reveal, AwwNaww, and others have said all along it is the USER that really MATTERS!!!!! I`m happy for you as I always thought the same way, it is good to see a positive, productive post of a fellow mpc user coming to realization of reaching maximium understanding of what he or she can do with the 4k.


You always get out of the gear what you put in it.


On that note please post tips and tricks to those with less understanding and experience on their units. Alot of misunderstanding is going on this board too.

Peace out.

P.S I usually mess with Q-link pad editor or program editor when i want to adjust decay and attack of notes as the sequencer is running.

By the way of course the 4k is way more powerful than the 5k working with a looped sample in keygroups you can go fking crazy with that thing.

I work with the 4k by itself and integrated with software instruments in Logic too as the 4k as a midi controller and sequencer. It is the user bang on player.

Alot of what I can do with software teaches too what I can do with a 4k.

Yeah software informs the hardware and visa versa.
Alot of the later and thickening techniques that come from spending hours on the mpcs hatching ultimate beat plans can be transfered to logic.
I use logic too but am actually trying to transfer alot of my stuff into the mpc.

I am trying to get away from the computer because i find I never build up my fundementals with the computer, where as the mpc will always load my programs, and the kurz when it arrives the same. I still have my mpc2k stuff still using it.
I have lost so much stuff over the years from transfering operating systems, sequencers, plugins not being rewritten,
Its just not funny.

To the point I have an old powerbook, and a new macbook as I can't be bothered to buy all the upgrades necessary to run my plugins on the intel.

I have already planned my day, its great I know what I am doing with th 4k and so can wake up and go okay these drums need to be created this needs to be added to my autoload.
It all seems possible.

I would say it again new users learn the drum programming for two days then step it up by transfering that to keygroups and up the level.

Mcsmooth has written many helpful posts on his approach to drum patches, they helped me through it.
Got a big drum program to write an ARP bass to program and a song to finish, gonna be a good day!

g

extreme sample converter http://www.extranslator.com/ is you next step
you can convert VSTIs into z4/8 keygroup pgrms in 24bit 96k (I go 24/48 myself) and BlueHaze was right on the money with software opening the gates of understanding of the 4k can do esp. Ableton Live. Also to dive into it even deeper Hit the "Window" button over every cursor spot in every section of this thin. I mean Really get lost in it. Like I say all the time I am still learning about what this thing can do

Good work man, and thanks for the props. This is a great testimonial that proves that anyone can learn this machine by simply getting their hands dirty. It seems we are a rare breed of 4k users that actually use the beast for what it is capable of and take the time to learn. This is why there will never be another MPC like it.

I find that often when there is a limitation, there is a work around. Sure software can do everything easier and better now, but if we wanted to use it, we wouldn't have MPCs. I feel I know about everything there is to know on this machine in terms of technical abilities, parameters, and settings, but you will find that you keep coming up with new ideas and ways to work around the problems as you continue to program.

The 16 level attack/decay/filter thing was prob never implemented bec of the differences in the machine. Tune and velocity are the only parameters built into the sequencer. Pad control seems to be the feature that was added to make the 4k behave more like the 2k in this respect. Best bet is to assign a q-link to one of these parameters and move the knob/slider as you bang on the pads (or apply after sequencing). I know it isn't the same, but could help. Q-link sequence is also be useful to visually see the levels.