just starting to dig - any tips for me?

no argumentation in here.

i just agree to O.S.T., nothing more.

lol that blog post was funny

I know I'll catch some flack for this but the truth is this part of the forum is seriously slacking in digging knowledge. Just look at most of the threads in here and you'll see people are rarely spreading any true knowledge and will often make comments that show how little they truly know. Not that they have bad intentions but they're misleading in their info. Look at the new finds thread (with some exceptions: i.e. that Leon Spencer record is hot) and people are posting A-ha, Men with Hats, & other various garbage as finds. Those records are garbage. And you can take that from someone who's been doing this for a pretty long time, has a vast array of records and personally enjoys many musical styles. I recommend you seek knowledge through some very simple steps that will truly help you out. I as well as most diggers & collectors I know have gone through slightly similar paths.

Google "Ultimate Breaks & Beats" and start memorizing the artists and titles included in those compilations. Go out to record stores, garage sales, whatever, and seek out those records. Take the time to read the back of the record covers while listening to the music. When you notice elements of the music that you really like(i.e. the way the drummer plays) memorize that drummer's name and go out searching for his records while you're still looking for the other ones already on your mental want list. After some time (2-3 years) you will have developed a repertoir of artists and labels that you look for that will slowly change through the years depending on you musical tastes and what you find within those recordings.

One thing takes you to the next and eventually you will have a mental list of records, labels, artists, producers, etc..., that you look for. I started off looking for drum breaks and jazz and ended up moving on to so many other styles such as: Salsa, Funk, Soul, Disco, Modern Soul, House and much much more. I'd say I've gone past the faze of getting records for samples to make Hip Hop beats, to just buy music I like and practically not listen to hip hop anymore because I enjoy more the original music.

Theres so much music out there that you'll never know everything and just when you thought you knew something you'll read an article or speak to someone who will take you further and vice versa.
The real way to acquire knowledge in all this is like anything in life through hard work "blood, sweat & tears".
Get out there every week if possible and look for stuff as mentioned before.
Here are 3 artists that are OBVIOUS for most record collectors/diggers but that will yield good music and even better samples:

Barry White - everything he's done, produced, etc..., from 1970 to 1975
Isaac Hayes - same thing but between 1967 & 1976
James Brown - same thing but between 1966 & 1976

^^^This alone is ESSENTIAL digging in terms of funky/soulful music.

If you have any further questions I suggest you look elsewhere on forums such as http://www.the-breaks.com ( I personally do NOT approve of that site as a long term spot but believe it's useful for people starting off).
Take it from there.

^ Sharing knowledge is kind of a gray-area because a lot of people who take pride in their original/fresh samples aren't going to be like "hey fellow people who sample, here's some heat ____". Plus calling people out isn't productive, especially if you're going to tell me there's no drums on an album that has a bunch, and then not respond to me afterwards once I reply. I appreciate people who share knowledge/post up digs/offer advice, but putting others down is just being pretentious.

But yeah, if we (everyone) can come to a common ground of being more open with crate-knowledge then it will only be for the good. I got some Xmas money and am taking a road trip to this awesome record store in Lawrence Kansas by KU tomorrow and I'm bringing a crate of heat to trade. I'll post up some of what I bring back, but not with the intension of taking flack, because I buy whatever I think I would like to listen to/sample. Not to be graded on a crate-digger grading-scale, just because as we both believe, we should all share knowledge.

I'm not trying to start beef, just thought I'd use this opportunity to try and improve this section, which you seem to want to do to.

ssnedden wrote:^ Sharing knowledge is kind of a gray-area because a lot of people who take pride in their original/fresh samples aren't going to be like "hey fellow people who sample, here's some heat ____". Plus calling people out isn't productive, especially if you're going to tell me there's no drums on an album that has a bunch, and then not respond to me afterwards once I reply. I appreciate people who share knowledge/post up digs/offer advice, but putting others down is just being pretentious.

But yeah, if we (everyone) can come to a common ground of being more open with crate-knowledge then it will only be for the good. I got some Xmas money and am taking a road trip to this awesome record store in Lawrence Kansas by KU tomorrow and I'm bringing a crate of heat to trade. I'll post up some of what I bring back, but not with the intension of taking flack, because I buy whatever I think I would like to listen to/sample. Not to be graded on a crate-digger grading-scale, just because as we both believe, we should all share knowledge.

I'm not trying to start beef, just thought I'd use this opportunity to try and improve this section, which you seem to want to do to.

I'm glad you're chipping in. I'm not implying we uncover our secret squirrel sh*t. I know I'll never do that. But I find there are a lot of people in here talking out their a*s without owning records or having any true knowledge. I don't consider myself a "super digger" or anything along those lines. However, I have the confidence that I have acquired a certain amount of knowledge and records to be in a position to help others who are humble enough and ask for it properly. It might be that I'm in a festive mood and feel like helping out, who knows. I'm not trying to call out anyone in particular although there are a couple of people on here who have specifically talked out their a*s without truly knowing.
Let's just take this somewhere better this year. You know what I mean?

PS: Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to school anybody. I just want to help this guy out. I know I've spent way too much time, effort and even money going looking for some of the records I have to just give away the knowledge. So that's not happening. However for someone who's starting off, the information I've provided is gold and will really take them to the next level in my opinion.

O.S.T. wrote:PS: Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to school anybody. I just want to help this guy out. I know I've spent way too much time, effort and even money going looking for some of the records I have to just give away the knowledge. So that's not happening. However for someone who's starting off, the information I've provided is gold and will really take them to the next level in my opinion.

That's cool, but like I said - you told me I was wrong when I said there were hella open drums on some record, when there are. I don't see how that's being productive or knowledgeable. I appreciate you adding to our (like you said, weak) knowledge base here, I just think we should all avoid fitting the pretentious crate digger stereotype bill.

I even think we should have a sticky in this section strictly for dropping knowledge, but I'm not the most knowledgeable person here so I'm not going to go make it. If one is made, I'll contribute...

Anyway, I'm inexperienced in foreign, crazy, out there, music that is on the complex side of things (Brazilian, French, Dutch, you know what I'm talking about) if you or anyone else could give me a few things to look out for before I go to Lawrence tomorrow. But keep in mind it's a (although huge) record store in a college town in Kansas and some super rare, expensive, foreign records won't be of any use to me.
Thanks.

Oh, I really don't know what record you're talking about. Could you mention it so I can remember? Thanks

I don't know what kind of music you're specifically looking for but just keep it simple. Look for 45's on small labels that have names on them that sound African-American (Otis, Melvin, etc..). Bring a portable with you if possible.

I definitely need to get some 45 game. I avoid 45's like the plague, because I haven't had much luck with them.

I prefer to find whole albums and scour them to find samples.

I know it's more likely to find rare obscure music on 45, but it's a real crap shoot for me unless I bring a portable turntable, and I don't always have the time and/or patience to do that.

in response to OST and Sneddens discussion above -

there is definitly an awkward balance between spreading knowlege (answering questions) and giving away what we consider secret or private knowlege. it would be great if we had a couple of stickies dedicated to helping people who are just beginning to dig as well as a source of info for intermediates (like myself)

heres my model for a "super diggers faq":

part 1: a link to sites like 'the breaks' so that common knowledge can stay common.
this section could also include a list of respected labels for mid price digging, eg : probe, verve, cti, kpm, blah blah blah - no one giving away any big secrets, just putting people on the right path in terms of digging quality music.

part 2: a link to some good blogs ie "my jazz world" blogspot or "milk crate breaks" blogspot, these blogs have a search function, you can search a label and get a feel for their output.
after all, no ammount of information (ie a memorised list of reccomended jazz labels) will compare to listening experience when it comes to digging.

Also, having the ability to call out Common or poor digging from the recent finds thread without ruffling feathers is a must.

im sure a lot more can be added. It'd certainly be more constructive than all the "i bought all these records in a salvation army - are they any good for digging" type posts.

its all about helping this guy...

viewtopic.php?f=19&t=93229&hilit=bof+bonzz

O.S.T. wrote: (with some exceptions: i.e. that Leon Spencer record is hot)

DONT BUY RECORDS TO SAMPLE BUY THEM FOR THE MUSIC.


if you dont like what peeps post up then dont add to the thread simple.

dont put down other digg's cause YOU dont like them, everyone has there own taste ,LET THEM choose. there's plenty of knowlegde on this forum just cause you came in late doesnt mean thee aint search this forum and you will see.

these forums go through changes very few months or yrs cause of the people who come and join us
there's many people on here that enjoy other music THEN RAP!!!

I've been here for over 3 years, use to be under another user name so I'd say I know who's come and gone during that time and what this place looks like.
If you take the time to read my post you'll see I mention I practically don't listen to rap anymore and how I buy records for the music and NOT the samples. So your reply is redundant.

ssnedden: just noticed it was the Mongo LP that we had discussed last time. Here's a quote of what I said about it:

I was referring to the massive drum break craziness on the cover of "Cold Sweat". Besides that there aren't any "open drums".

I was surprised when you said there were a lot of open drums because I was only aware of the break on "Cold Sweat". Thus my question mark smiley. Just listened to it again and there aren't necessarily what I consider "open" drums other than like the 2 rolls at the intro of those 2 first songs. I usually don't sample rolls like that and dismiss them but I guess it does consist of open drum sounds. So you are right in that aspect. I didn't reply because there wasn't anything to add to the discussion at that point.

It's cool. It's just that I skipped through it and the one thing I noticed about it was the drums that (at least I would consider) were open and when you said that I was like

But I just got back from Lawrence KS with some cool records and if I can get my camera back from my friend I'll post some of what I picked up with prices and a quick review if I've listened to it by then.

illiterati wrote:
its all about helping this guy...

viewtopic.php?f=19&t=93229&hilit=bof+bonzz

LOL

That sh*t had me in tears. Crossings' comment just topped it all off :

must haves??? for listening pleasure??? ...this thread is a joke, right?

with the exception of that richard pryor what are you gonna listen to from that? you gonna crossfade some prince into mary poppins? who the hell poses on some myspace **** with dollarbin commons anyway?... this is making want to quit digging.