MPC 4000 with apogee ensemble or motu 828 mk3

I started this as a question to Feline, but i post it here so that everybody shares! I d appreciate your answers!

Im about to buy a new audio interface and i am between motu 828 mk3 and apogee ensemble.
I want to connect via adat the mpc to the audio interface, and "mix" the mpc channels in logic. Synced (midi-wordclock)

Also i m recording some extra stuff (guitars - bass - violin) thats why i want the interface as an "input" machine too.
As far as money concerned i m willing to pay 700 - 1300 euros.

"Problem" is, if apogee is too much for the work that i want to do, then 828 is a perfect choice for me.
I ve got a small home studio- macpro 8core, mpc4k, turntable, tla preamps, a mackie mixer etc. headphones monitoring (beyer 770pro)

So based in your experience and as in my country (greece) these machines are nowhere! so that i could hear them
(and so that i would not bother you with this e-mail) i 'm asking you what is your advice on these 2 cards?

I m making trip-hop style downtempo music, based on samples. I do all the sampling work in my mpc, but i care on the ad/da too, cause i record vocals, bass etc externally with session musicians.
Maybe its better to run the mics from the mpc inputs straight to adat -> macpro?

Help with your experince, and sorry again for all these questions!

thanks 4 your time

Apogee. Hands down. Apogee. Fantastic Converters, even in their 'cheap' stuff.

If all you were doing was coming in digital and then into the computer I'd say it doesn't matter, but anything analouge hitting converters? Of the two? Apogee.

You might even go as far as coming out analouge just to let the Apogee handle conversion. They sound fantastic.

well the fact is that ensemble doesnt offer midi interface so if i want to sync my mpc i ll have to buy the spdif / wordclock card..

but anyways!

thanks, i d appreciate the view of some other members too.

apogee does have awesome converters. but with no midi options with the apogee, i would go with the motu, all their stuff is solid.

I wouldn't sacrifice good converters because of the lack of midi I/O. I'd def go with the apogee and just add a dedicated 4x4 midi interface or something.

Have you actually heard one of two units?

mpampouras wrote:Have you actually heard one of two units?

Of course, no comparison. The ensemble is on different level.

I Agree. I've heard both and there really is no comparison. In that particular audio converter league, the Apogee dominates and does it HARD. The Motu may look a bit 'prettier' and may claim more features, but those features tend to be distractions from the real issue: Audio Quality (if you are trying for a competitive sound). In all fairness though, Motu makes very stable units, but if you can't hear your music accurately or if it records into your interface with poor quality, you'll spend extra time later trying to get your tracks to sound right and may not be able to achieve a competitive mix 'out of the box' in your personal or commercial setup. Apogee Ensemble, Apogee Rosetta 200 or 800, RME Fireface 400 or 800, Lynx Aurora 8 or 16 are all in about the same ball park in terms of sound quality, with the Ensemble being about the true entry level to contemporary competitive pro audio quality sound. Above all of that it gets kind crazy and of course subjective.

dabmeister wrote:

mpampouras wrote:Have you actually heard one of two units?

Of course, no comparison. The ensemble is on different level.

I will second that... I have used several audio interfaces before getting the Apogee duet.... the best $500 I have ever spent. Hands down Apogee, especially since you are using Logic. The core audio integration is awesome.

Well when apogee first came out everybody was complaining about stability with leopard issues.
I hope that all these are past now?

mpampouras wrote:Well when apogee first came out everybody was complaining about stability with leopard issues.
I hope that all these are past now?

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Yes i mean that when ensemble first came out there were several problems with drivers with mac os 10.5.5.
Are there any problems now?
Also how you compare it to the rme fireface?

well, maybe I'm outa place on the ensamble then, cause I'm really more familiar with the Rosetta's and the AD8000. Mostly used in HD and TDM systems. I know a guy who has the Mini Me with an Avalon 737 and it's sick, into Sonar. Apogee doesn't screw around, I'd be AMAZED if any initial issues are not resolved with driver updates, etc. It's been around a minute now.

Another thing to keep in mind is that it is not an uncommon thing for a newly released product to have a few issues. It's been this way since midi began and before. Apogee has long corrected some of the major issues with the Ensemble. RME at one time had somewhat unstable drivers for Macs, but even they have come up since then. If you are looking at getting an interface that is at the beginning threshold of what is 'Pro Audio' today, either the Fireface or the Ensemble will do. In general, the Fireface and the Ensemble are about 'neck and neck' in terms of quality. The Rosetta series is a step above, according to most and the AD or DA 16X series is prime at Apogee. Above those you find Mytek, Cranesong, Lavry, Benchmark, Prism Sound, etc. to be generally considered top flight. When you choose your converters, it's good to keep in mind what your objectives are. If you have a lot of outboard gear that you plan to track with other than the MPC 4000 and vocals or live stuff, then balancing your choice of good converters are key. If you are doing most of your stuff 'in the box' in your computer, then looking into a good sound card, like the Lynx AES16 or 16e with the ADAT option might be a better option along with getting an the ADAT option for your MPC 4000 (If you don't already have it installed). This would be a less expensive option with great sound quality and would allow you to focus your budget on a good Mic Pre (Again, if you don't have one already) and Stereo AD to DA setup. Reub.

They both sound very good. The out-of-the-box-MOTU doesnt sound as good as an Apogee but it is possible to upgrade (by BLA) the converters and signals paths of the MOTU (for cheap money) and then it will sound as good if not better..