MPC 5000 Groove Quantize/Extraction

Can the MPC 5000 do this?

Many software programs have some form of this, for instance:

Sonar has Audiosnap with it's quantize to grid functions.

Propellerheads Reason has the Regroove mixer.

Ableton Live 8 will also have groove extraction.

Is this possible on the MPC 5000?

This is more than just a swing setting. It actually allows the user to apply a groove (both timing and velocity) to midi data. This midi data doesn't always fit nicely into a normal quantized/swing setting, so that the end result sounds much more realistic and closer to what a real drummer would sound like. It's a nice feature to have especially when working with samples form old records. You can really flip something and still make it sound natural.

kb420ps wrote:Can the MPC 5000 do this?

Many software programs have some form of this, for instance:

Sonar has Audiosnap with it's quantize to grid functions.

Propellerheads Reason has the Regroove mixer.

Ableton Live 8 will also have groove extraction.

Is this possible on the MPC 5000?

This is more than just a swing setting. It actually allows the user to apply a groove (both timing and velocity) to midi data. This midi data doesn't always fit nicely into a normal quantized/swing setting, so that the end result sounds much more realistic and closer to what a real drummer would sound like. It's a nice feature to have especially when working with samples form old records. You can really flip something and still make it sound natural.

Idea chop up the break in recycle cuz it keeps the original groove and save as an akp file. Transfer it to the 5k with the t/c set to off. Now you have the original groove in the mpc and you can copy it to other tracks assign different programs to the put different samples onto the same pads just like we do on any mpc.

Thanks for the reply.

That's a workaround. I'm not really looking for a workaround. I just wanted to know if the 5000 could do this or not. Making an audio file a Rex file and then bringing it into the 5000 would preserve the original groove, but if I wanted to apply that same groove to new midi data that I wanted to compose, I don't see how that would work.

I guess the 5000 doesn't have it's own way of doing this without a workaround.

No problem.

kb420ps wrote:Thanks for the reply.

That's a workaround. I'm not really looking for a workaround. I just wanted to know if the 5000 could do this or not. Making an audio file a Rex file and then bringing it into the 5000 would preserve the original groove, but if I wanted to apply that same groove to new midi data that I wanted to compose, I don't see how that would work.

I guess the 5000 doesn't have it's own way of doing this without a workaround.

No problem.

Yeah it is just an mpc but the principles are the same as software accept no automation you have to do it by hand. Software just takes the manual labor out for us but this is the way the pros did it for since the 90s with samplers.

Alot of this is forgetten as software ease running all of this in the background.

Simply turn off the 5Ks quantize....

Askia Shaheed wrote:Simply turn off the 5Ks quantize....

LOL!

That's funny.

I know you can do that. I've been using a MPC 3000 for well over 10 years. Live's approach is a little bit more than that, but thanks for the feedback.


Just take a look at the first minute of the Live 8 movie:

http://www.ableton.com/pages/live_8/announcement/home

I just didn't know if the 5000 had something like this. Propellerheads Reason has something similar. Here is a link to that:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cckO66Tb ... s_regroove


I miss the hands on approach of the MPC, so I was considering buying a 5000. Just trying to figure out the pros and cons of using the 5000 exclusively.

All midi sequencers logic, cubuse, dp, and ableton and etc do the same add grooves to the midi data nondestructively.

Hardware since you are working with an mpc 3000 you know going back is permanent. So you have to do it by hand no hardware sequencer I know of (there might be one who knows) edits and imprints like software sequencers as of yet. That is all of the automation we talked about earlier.

You have to do what you want by hand. No automation in hardware. But unlike ableton which I use too the swing on an mpc is kicking compared to ableton`s sequencer`s.


However going back to your original question you just need to do at we said before even on your 3k turn the quantization off and copy to next track assign new programs and reassign the sounds to pads.


Sorry no automated drag and drop on hardware.

P.S. the 5k would be easier than the 3k as it has a grid screen so you can even edit the midi data by sight and hand if need to get that original groove. The 3k only has a step edit numeric screen for that.

Blue Haze wrote: But unlike ableton which I use too the swing on an mpc is kicking compared to ableton`s sequencer`s.

You really think the swing is different? Have you experimented with both? Can you prove that what you are saying is the truth and not placebo?

kb420ps wrote:

Blue Haze wrote: But unlike ableton which I use too the swing on an mpc is kicking compared to ableton`s sequencer`s.

You really think the swing is different? Have you experimented with both? Can you prove that what you are saying is the truth and not placebo?

Can you?

Blue Haze wrote:

kb420ps wrote:

Blue Haze wrote: But unlike ableton which I use too the swing on an mpc is kicking compared to ableton`s sequencer`s.

You really think the swing is different? Have you experimented with both? Can you prove that what you are saying is the truth and not placebo?

Can you?

Well, I did compare the two. I set up a 1 bar loop on the MPC 3000 playing hi hats on every 16th with no swing, and then a 63% swing. I then did the same thing in Sonar. The results were the same. I couldn't tell the difference.

Now don't get me wrong. When I first got the MPC years ago, it's swing was definitely better than other hardware sequencers of the time. As a matter of fact, I had an ASR 10 before I bought the MPC, and the ASR's sequencer was terrible. It didn't have swing at all, and it's timing sort of "coughed" from time to time.

Now I think it's more hype than anything, but I could be wrong.

You say you are a Live user. Why not give it a try yourself? Just so you know, in Live you will have to use swing 16 instead of swing 8.

Thanks I already have. I use ableton for my remixes with aceppellas and such. For me midi sequencing rhythm tracks and sample based tracks on a mpc is different but I not going to debate all of that cuz we both would be here all night.

Click on my sign to hear the beats and tracks I make if you want understand that the feel and groove I work for.


I would like to check out your feel and groove on your work based on ableton.

Blue Haze wrote:Thanks I already have. I use ableton for my remixes with aceppellas and such. For me midi sequencing rhythm tracks and sample based tracks on a mpc is different but I not going to debate all of that cuz we both would be here all night.

It is different because of the hands on approach of the MPC. Everything is mapped out. No need to go looking through a menu with a mouse to find a function or a parameter. I agree with you there. That's the reason I started this thread in the first place.

Another thing is latency. You will never have a problem with latency when working with hardware. Also, groove is easier to do by hand on the MPC without quantizing because there is no latency. You turn the quantize off on an MPC and record midi data. You still get back exactly what you played. Try that with software and see what happens.


But quantized swing as in the "MPC" swing, I don't know. I think that may be more hype than anything. We don't have to hear each others tracks to prove/disprove that. That's too subjective. The only quantitative way to prove it is to do a simple 1 bar loop of hi hats on every 16th with swing applied to it to see if there is a difference. Anything else is just placebo.

There is shifting and different swing settings on different tracks forward and backwards on an mpc. And like you say you get more of a human feel when played by hand. So I record my mpc outs into logic as a audio track and use the audio sequencing of ableton retaining my groove feel.

Anyways like before ableton is cool I use it often with Logic too. But to get groove extraction on a mpc is has to done by hand.

Peace out.