Somebody should make a computer program that emulates...

decrepitude wrote:

sparq wrote:what was said above but instead of exporting to wav, how about having the ability to rewire into the DAW. Propellerheads offers free rewire development kits and issues the license for free.

read up on it at www.propellerheads.se and follow the links to rewire

now that would be hot.

Great idea, but Akai would have to be willing to put Rewire code into the OS. Rewire functionality has to be coded into any program that intends to be compatible with it as a slave or master.

This problem is not uncommon for folks using midi hardware devices with modern recording equipment. A lot of folks won't even track thier synths. They simply use a midi control track, or send out midi-timecode (not the same as mid-clock) and the synths/samplers run along side the recorded tracks in sync. Why even commmit a synth/sampler to a track when you could edit your tracks all the way until mixdown time? Obviously, if you want to apply internal FX from your DAW, then you will have to commit to a track. But you could potentially go back and re-record the midi performance again if neccessary. But a big advantage to not rendering is the you're using the output of the synth/sampler during the mix instead of the output of a recorded track. In most cases this will yield much better sonic results.

People like Access (the makers of the mighty Virus) have started to integrate plug-in technology with thier synths like the "TI" which stands for total integration. So maybe AKAi will see the advantages of implementing these same kind of features for MPC units in the future.

MPC4000 implements well with FXpansion Guru already. But I don't think the majority needs a total emulation of the MPC1000 OS, I think the "render track to wav" is the function that most MPC1000 owners will appreciate.

"MPC4000 implements well with FXpansion Guru already. But I don't think the majority needs a total emulation of the MPC1000 OS, I think the "render track to wav" is the function that most MPC1000 owners will appreciate."

agreed. this would do away with the need for assignable outs, in a sense

Antonym wrote:"MPC4000 implements well with FXpansion Guru already. But I don't think the majority needs a total emulation of the MPC1000 OS, I think the "render track to wav" is the function that most MPC1000 owners will appreciate."

agreed. this would do away with the need for assignable outs, in a sense

Yeah And you'll get 1 less DA/AD conversion on your sound as well. Probably not the biggest concern if you have Pro Tools HD systems, but it's a big advantage if you have a crappy sound card.

So tell me again,

without proper dsp code for at minimum re-tuning, filtering and enveloping, how would you actually use this rendered output?

personally all my beats would sound way wrong if all the filters and envelopes were de-activated. even tuning needs a degree of intelligent algo writing to accomplish the interpolation of sample data.

the only use i could see would be as a 'reference file' on the pc to help you remember what different mpc projects sounded like without loading them up. That would be of some use, i suppose.

orjanbeats wrote:But I don't think the majority needs a total emulation of the MPC1000 OS, I think the "render track to wav" is the function that most MPC1000 owners will appreciate.

I totally must agree with Sleepersriddle on this one. How the hell do you think you´ll have any use for a "render track to wav" function if it not emulates the key functions of the MPC?
I doubt noone will appreciate such an application if the result from it don´t sound at all how it sounded in the MPC, and thats the case if not filters, envelopes, Q-link data, LFO and tuning isn´t recreated very truthful in the application.
I ain´t no software designer, but I presume that someone with skills have to jack the MPC OS and port it to be able to run on Mac / PC hardware. I guess that´s not an easy task.
I think you people are moving a little fast on this one, not realizing the magnitude of this project.

Like I posted years ago, all I wanted was akai to make a program that has a jpeg of an mpc on screen that does most of the functions of an mpc with a dedicated controller(mpd16, I know) and can use asio and midi interfaces. nothin more nothing less. I know this can be built, why? Cause my old celeron 1gig can emulate arcade machines using Nec V series cpus and supporting chips at full frame rate. This was done by programmers in their spare time with no money. So we know that mpc60 to mpc200xl can be fully emulated considering that nothing in the older mpc's is proprietary unless i am talking out of my a$$ and there is alot of info on how to code nec v series. I would gladly pay Akai or anybody at least $300 for this Since i am always packing up my gig to bring it out of town with me.

jwalgran wrote:I am a software developer and I am very interested in writing this app. Please list the features that would be most important to you. Patch compatibility with the 1K is in there for sure. What else would you like?

I would make a shrine with candles and worship you untill the day i die.

ryssen wrote:If this should be realized the filters, envelopes, the Q-link parameters and preferably the LFO must most certainly be simulated very closely.
Just throwing in the raw samples, tracking them down according to sequence and then try to do the filtering and anveloping in the DAW will be so much more time consuming than just record them track by track. And you´ll never come near sound of the MPC.
Who here isn´t filtering, applying envelopes and messes with real time manipulations while composing? If not these functions are copied with minute care you´ll be working blind on the MPC, not knowing how it will sound before you run your files through the application.
I´m not trying to put your spirits down, but this seems like a too large project to ever be realized, but it would be fun if someone proved me wrong.

Good point.. The only thing that i could live without is the FX since they are not to good. But PITCH, FILTER, LFO, LOOP, Q-LINK is very important in my matter.


Maybe it would be a good idea to ask the RS-16X guy how he did. If he cracked the os or got a licence and how he did it. Hope he is willing to share the info. [email protected]

oh, i'm not saying it's impossible.

but MAME and whatever were certainly major projects with lots of people+hours sunk into it.

i'm just trying to point out it would be way more coding effort than eg. bluebox, and its not really true to talk about 'it's easy to 'just' render the wavs'.

triplegreen, my thoughts exactly. The only reason Akai hasn't made a software MPC (or licensed a software shop to write it for them) is to prevent a drop off in hardware sales.

The points made about filters, LFOs, etc. are spot on. For an emulation app to render a sequence properly, it would have to match the way the MPC does these things.

As an example of a 2-man development shop that successfully emulated a hardware device, check out the Phase Two by Audio Damage. They bought a Mu-Tron Bi-Phase, studied it, then built a plugin that sounds _very_ close to the real deal. It's certainly achievable to match the sound of the 1000 just by analyzing the way it manipulates the WAV files. No need to "hack" the OS. Purists will never be on board, but it's not for them, anyway. I've always seen the 1000 as the "progressive" MPC.

I see a "sequence render" app getting written in phases. It's not a challenge to just parse the sequence and put place the WAV files in order. That would be version 0.1. The follow up to that would be a process of taking each feature of the MPC, one at a time, and adding the functionality to the software. Tuning and looping first, then harder things like envelopes, LFOs, Q-link, and filter.

I guess I should actually get a 1000

Ait cool, how long do you think it will take to write the 0.1 version?

Definitely get an MPC1000! And max it out with Kingston ram or other cheap brands. I have the original Akai EXM128 but that's because I got the MPC with ram included. I don't think I would buy an original exm128 myself.

decrepitude wrote:

sparq wrote:what was said above but instead of exporting to wav, how about having the ability to rewire into the DAW. Propellerheads offers free rewire development kits and issues the license for free.

read up on it at www.propellerheads.se and follow the links to rewire

now that would be hot.

Great idea, but Akai would have to be willing to put Rewire code into the OS. Rewire functionality has to be coded into any program that intends to be compatible with it as a slave or master.

This problem is not uncommon for folks using midi hardware devices with modern recording equipment. A lot of folks won't even track thier synths. They simply use a midi control track, or send out midi-timecode (not the same as mid-clock) and the synths/samplers run along side the recorded tracks in sync. Why even commmit a synth/sampler to a track when you could edit your tracks all the way until mixdown time? Obviously, if you want to apply internal FX from your DAW, then you will have to commit to a track. But you could potentially go back and re-record the midi performance again if neccessary. But a big advantage to not rendering is the you're using the output of the synth/sampler during the mix instead of the output of a recorded track. In most cases this will yield much better sonic results.

People like Access (the makers of the mighty Virus) have started to integrate plug-in technology with thier synths like the "TI" which stands for total integration. So maybe AKAi will see the advantages of implementing these same kind of features for MPC units in the future.

you're right but when i said this, i wasn't referring to akai making the program.

the rewire code would be put in the program that is written.

jwalgran wrote:I am a software developer and I am very interested in writing this app. Please list the features that would be most important to you. Patch compatibility with the 1K is in there for sure. What else would you like?

this is the person i was directing my suggestion to.

if the code is written in this program, it wouldn't matter what akai has in their code.

i think 'all' that needs to be done is to emulate the hardware (ie. cpu etc) this how the arcade machines have been emulated, not by 'adapting' the games code to run on a pc/mac. if the hardware was emulated exactly, you could open any new os that turned up, plus you could use any os too, so for those with tracks they made in 1.07, that don't work in 2.10, they could just open the emulator, and run the different os! simple!

jwalgran wrote:
I guess I should actually get a 1000

I really recommend the 1k. Best damn thing I ever bought.

What I would do (if I knew how) would be to try to run the 1k OS on a computer. It was probably written in in a MAC/PC to begin with.

Who knows, maybe its written in LINUX-code?

Cats hack things every day and I dont think AKAI has put to much effort in "security". Heh, people even got MAC os X running on PCs now.

Although if you get it to run on a computer i dont think its really fare to release a computer based version of the MPC OS. Only something that can bounce tracks properly or it might crush AKAI as a company and that would make us all cry. At least me.

Peace man!

I currently use an MPC 1000 and Battery 2 with Logic. Since Battery is very similar to the MPC in layout (you assign sounds to "pads" with midi note numbers and can set filter, ADSR envelope etc), what I'm currently wishing for is software that could import an MPC program into Battery.

Since I record and chop all my audio inside my ibook, instead of tracking my beats into Logic I've been creating the same program for Battery and the MPC (with Pad 187 - really useful app!), doing the beat in the MPC and then saving sequence info and importing it into Logic, stick it on an instrument track with a multi-out instance of Battery and start mixing - no real-time tracking required!

I'm not really bothered about all the individual settings (filter, decay etc), while that would be a plus all I really need is the ability to import the sounds assigned to the same pads. That alone would save me a LOT of time.

Does anyone else use this workaround or similar?